[Guest]

Peter Sorrell of Wolf/Trident is having a sale on his exhausts - $220 off the normal price for the half system.

http://www.t595.net/messageboard/thread/43298.aspx

 

[Tight TL]

Devious,
I have an email from Peter with a dyno chart of the Trident half system on an S3. It shows terrific gains for any system let alone a half system. The $220 off the price sounds like a bargain I shouldn't pass up. I would like your opinion on the system. Your word carries some weight around here because it is the result of years of hands-on experience that few of us have. I recall that you said your Trident half system needed some cleaning up (slag, etc.) as did HiVels when you worked on his. Is this something a general welder can do or do I need to go to a performance shop where they know exhaust systems? Do you consider this a minor inconvienence or a quality control issue?
Thanks for helping me out.
Fred

 

[Guest]

In the midpipe, my system had about a 1/2 inch of metal hanging in the flow where the pipes were cut to blend together. The oxygen sensor bung hangs into the flow quite a bit. Also, the end of the pipes, where they enter the silencers, had material from where they were cut.

On HiVel's midpipe, the material was greatly reduced - MUCH better QC. I cleaned it up a bit and only needed to grind the O2 bung out of the way with a 6 inch shank bur and a die grinder.

Is the Trident any better than the Arrow or other half systems? I honestly can't say. I do like the sound of my Carbon silencers, and the louder, larger diameter piping.

 

[cheapbastard]

Is the Trident any better than the Arrow or other half systems? I honestly can't say. I do like the sound of my Carbon silencers, and the louder, larger diameter piping.

Devi, I would love to hear your thoughts on the chainreaction exhaust(old squids). Don't know if you've seen them in the flesh or not, but they are a work of art, and talk about music to yer ears... ;D  I want some, just don't see it being possible fer a long time to come! :'(

 

[Guest]

Cheap,
In the mid-pipe, do the Chain Reaction silencers "T" together, or use a "Y" shaped merge? I think I remember them having a T fitting and a couple of 90 degree bends prior to this.
Do you know the pipe diameter?

I actually like the look Old Squid has developed, and would like to hear them.

 

[HarriS]

I have the said Trident dynosheet. At triumphrat he claimed 14hp gain with his half system while everybody else got couple of hp. He promised the dynosheet for more than six months. He said he had technical problems to scan and putting it online. Then he offered to send paper copies on mail. The sheets never arrived anybody he said he had mailed them. I was one of them. I offered to host the graph on my website because it was not possible for him for reasons only he knows. The he sent a digipic of some dynosheet. I put it online as I had promised him. I mentioned there is something funny about the graph because the torque and hp curves did not match each other. Half an hour later he emailed me and told me to remove the picture from my website and said he had put the rat moderators after me. I received an email from a moderator and he said Mr Sorrell had told them I have published his graph without his permission and he had told the moderator that there is some kind of agreement between TR and Trident that they will never publish any Trident dynographs. The moderator told me he is not aware of any such agreement but he was forced to remove my entire post.

Nuff said.

 

[Guest]

The restriction in the exhaust is not the mid-pipe. It is the precat in the header. Until this is removed, or an aftermarket header is used, a better flowing half system isn't going to do much.

Even then, it will take a few other mods to get a lot more out of the bike. This has a lot to do with why even the full systems don't make a lot more power over stock. If the fueling is not tuned for the increased flow of any mods, you will not make more power, and can even go backwards.

I bought the Trident half system becaust it looked to be the easiest to modify later to work with a custom header, and had the largest diameter of any duel silencer system I could find.

The single sided systems have a couple of benefits over the dual exhaust systems. The first is that they have a short length from the silencer to the header's collector - making the total collector length shorter. They also don't have bends between the silencers and the header that can restrict flow.

This shorter collector length can help to make better peak power, but can also hurt low speed torque if it is too short for the cam timing.

 

[Tight TL]

So I guess the bottom line is this...the S3 is too midly tuned for much hp and tq from any exhaust system. However, custom cold air intake, custom snorkel rerouting, custom velocity stacks, precat removal, ceramic coating, and custom tune begin to wake up the beast and will benefit any exhaust system. Mill the head to increase the compression ratio, clean up the ports, radius valve job, and perhaps custom cams will really bring things to life and be able to take full advantage of an exhaust. Does that sound about right?
Fred

 

[Guest]

You pretty much nailed it on the head.

We'll have to see just how much it does wake up.

For me, the most noticeable gains were from going from TORS and tune to the Wayne Macdonal's tune. After that is started getting a bit harder to raise the bar.

The intake work and cold air ducting really helped the header work come alive.

No it is time to look for a bit more efficiency and airflow in and out of the engine.

 

[HarriS]

Devious, drop in some Daytona cams and clean the ports. Report how it runs and I might do the same if it works. ;D

Cut the stock header and use the stock adapters (cast turns from the head) and fit 40-41mm primary tubes in them, proper collector, single motogp style can...drool.

On the other hand some cnc machined flanges would not be too hard to manufacture. The difficult part would be the oval turns. Simply flattening some bend might not be the best solution. Hydroforming would do it but the tooling cost is beyond hobby tuners.

 

[Guest]

HarriS - QUIT it! You are making me drool, and think - I don't know which is worse.

I am gunning for 145 hp and very good torque at a reasonable rpm.

 

[Guest]

Will Daytona Cams fit right in?

You see this?


http://www.t595.net/messageboard/thread/43354.aspx

Mark

 

[Guest]

Just how far do you want to raise the powerband - 25 degrees more duration with increased lift is a LOT.

 

[HarriS]

The powerband would be somewhere between Daytona and S3 because the same cams are milder in bigger displacement engine. I am not fully sure how the different bore/stoke/rod lenght ratio would affect. At least more lift than stock s needed.

 

[Guest]

It all comes back to head flow and piston speed.

 

[cheapbastard]

Cheap,
In the mid-pipe, do the Chain Reaction silencers "T" together, or use a "Y" shaped merge? I think I remember them having a T fitting and a couple of 90 degree bends prior to this.
Do you know the pipe diameter?

I actually like the look Old Squid has developed, and would like to hear them.

Hey Devi, just got this pic from limey. Don't know the diameter, but here's a pic of the midpipe, whacha think?

 

[Guest]

So it IS a Y shaped merge. Not bad, but depending on the tubing diameter, the added 90 degree bend may be an issue to flow - but more than likely not.

If you keep the bike relatively stock - tune, filter, etc., all half systems will make close to the same power. Above 130 rphw, they will start to show differences IMHO.

I like 'EM.
What do they cost?

 

[Guest]

$850 for the half system.

 

[Guest]

Limey,
Can you make a sound file of them?
It will give us an idea of what they sound like.

I just MAY have to talk to Old Squid about a custom 2 inch OD midpipe.
Do you have contact info? He e-mailed me a while back, but I deleted it after responding.

 

[cheapbastard]

Limey,
Can you make a sound file of them?
It will give us an idea of what they sound like.

man devi, they sound awesome! I haven't had a chance to hear many aftermarket exhaust on the S3, but they are the best sounding I've heard. I would love to hear a Zard in person too, just to see what those suckas sound like! Wouldn't mind hearing the Tridents with that pre-cat removed either. ;D